if you had 5-6 embies on day 3 (some good, some ok): would you wait until day 5?

(53 posts)(14 voices)
  1. If I were you and you're doing a day 3 transfer....let's say you transfer 3 embryos and you have 3 left. Let the 3 remaining go to blast and whatever makes it to blast, freeze those. You may end up with 3 blasts in the freezer, you may end up with none. You don't have to decide anything - just give them that instruction and that's that. Don't take no for an answer.

    I am of the opinion that anything that makes it to blast is worth freezing. At age 39, it's not wise to discard an embryo that might make a baby - and you cannot tell from looking at them. You could also freeze the remainder on day 3 but if you take them to blast you will have a better chance with your FETs later on because blasts have a higher implantation rate.

    Somebody really needs to ask Cornell why on earth are they not vitrifying all the time yet.

  2. Why do you ask 1,001 questions all over IVFC insinuating you are starting a cycle or in the midst of one when in fact you are not.

    You\'ve been asking a million questions here for months and offering zero support to anyone else.

    Why don't you go consult with a specialist and then when you are on the schedule you can come back and spam the board with all your garbage. It's been over a year of you asking a million questions and you still haven't cycled yet.

    I wonder when your next meltdown will be. Get a grip already.

  3. Why do you ask 1,001 questions all over IVFC insinuating you are starting a cycle or in the midst of one when in fact you are not. You've been asking a million questions here for months and offering zero support to anyone else.

    WOW... Feeling supportive?

    This is an IF support group. IF/IVF has a learning curve, and OP's asking questions, so she can learn. Are some of the questions a bit of an overkill? Perhaps, but that doesn't matter b/c that's how she's learning. It also doesn't matter whether she's cycling, in the midst of a cycle or not cycling, she's asking questions so she can learn and be an advocate for her own healthcare as she's going through this IF hell. When she's had a cycle or 2 or has enough knowledge about all of this stuff, then she can always give back by sharing the knowledge that she's now accumulating with other women just starting this IF process. When I started in this IF hell, I too asked a million questions and gave very little support b/c I didn't know what the hell I was into. Many loving and supportive women tiredlessly answered my probably overkill questions, so I can learn. Now that I have quite a few cycles and experience under my belt, I'm giving back to the community by sharing the knowledge that I've accumulated.

    So... If you're not up to giving back to the community, then don't. But, please don't harrass the OP for asking questions. That's just petty and really uncool.

  4. is I think there is something else besides the 1,001 questions going on. Not sure what but my own belief is I don't believe estel is a legit IVF patient. She spams CO, NY, CA, NJ and VA IVF boards asking questions and insinuating she is cycling in one of these 5 states.

    She even lied and said she was cycling (ordering medication on Monday) when she wasn't. She had a meltdown against a seasoned supporter here because she didn't like her answer. Read her history. Most of it is there. How could she possibly be cycling in 5 different states in the span of 2 months?

  5. So what? Just ignore it if it bothers you.

  6. It's a hard decision and I think you will have more concrete information about a day 3 vs. day 5 transfer (and more applicable to your specific situation instead of say what the studies say) when your doc and embryologist see how your embryos are developing on day 3 (not sure where you are cycling but some clinics like CCRM don't look at embryos until day 3 while some look at them daily so there may be no way to know how they are developing until day 3) but it is good to be educated so you can participate in the decision and feel good about it when that time comes. I have been through 5 fresh IVF cycles (one locally and 4 at a top tier clinic) and have always been a day 3 transfer with nothing ever left to be frozen (really none of our embryos have progressed much past day 3/4---never had an embryo not transferred on day 3 make it to blast in the lab even at what is considered one of the best clinics in the country). This was surprising b/c I was only 29yo when we started with IVF and I had normal fsh levels, good response to stims, healthy etc. But there was an unexplained egg quality issue that caused our embryos to struggle to divide by day 3 (and made it clear to us already by day 3 which one's appeared best). Out of about 100 eggs retrieved in all my cycles, we only ever had one 8 cell with the rest being 6 cells or less on day 3. Not normal for my age. I personally think in SELECT cases such as mine, day 3 transfers may have an advantage over day 5 and some docs will say that if embryos are showing signs of struggling in the lab by day 3 it may be best to transfer them. In my last cycle, the best I had on day 3 to transfer was a 5 cell and three 4 cell embryos, very behind in development so obviously I did not have the odds on my side. But lo and behold that cycle was a success. My beta hcg levels started out very low (23 when they should have been 50 or higher on 11dp3dt) and then rose somewhat slowly. Based on that embryo being only 5 or 4 cells and the low beta levels, I have my doubts that that embryo would have made it to blast in the lab even by day 6 (hard to know for sure though obviously). We had been given the option of waiting until day 5 to see if anything made it but I am glad now that we didn't do that. Now had I had a bunch of excellent embryos (perfect 8 cell embryos) on day 3, I probably would have opted to push till day 5 because even though looks aren't everything (I can't tell you how many stories I have heard over the years of the best looking perfect blasts testing chromosomally abnormal while the poorest looking ones making perfect babies) I would guess I would have a few normals left. It's when the situation isn't as black and white that makes it harder. Best of luck to you!

  7. is I think there is something else besides the 1,001 questions going on. Not sure what but my own belief is I don't believe estel is a legit IVF patient. She spams CO, NY, CA, NJ and VA IVF boards asking questions and insinuating she is cycling in one of these 5 states. She even lied and said she was cycling (ordering medication on Monday) when she wasn't. She had a meltdown against a seasoned supporter here because she didn't like her answer. Read her history. Most of it is there. How could she possibly be cycling in 5 different states in the span of 2 months?

    hi. what is this? i am in my first cycle now! and all has gone very well. thanks for asking!

    gosh, Green MI: you sound unwell.

    i have ER in 2 days as i just posted before i opened this thread. we were considering cycling in several states where my DH's company has office and he could relocate and work for the 2 wks. we would be out-of-state cycling.

    to Green MI: i hope you get the help you need so you can lead a good life.

  8. It\'s a hard decision... some clinics like CCRM don't look at embryos until day 3 while some look at them daily so there may be no way to know how they are developing until day 3) Best of luck to you!

    hi, thank you! my RE said this morning that it will probably be a hard decision given the mature follicle count today on stim day 10. and the embryologist at our clinic only looks on fert day and day 3.
    thanks for helping!

  9. hi. what is this? i am in my first cycle now! and all has gone very well. thanks for asking! gosh, Green MI: you sound unwell. i have ER in 2 days as i just posted before i opened this thread. we were considering cycling in several states where my DH's company has office and he could relocate and work for the 2 wks. we would be out-of-state cycling.to Green MI: i hope you get the help you need so you can lead a good life.

    Two wrongs don't make a right, Jen. Did you decide on the Paxil?

  10. hi, thank you! my RE said this morning that they only look on day 3. i did ask if i could find out before being in the room for ET and he said they can possibly look about an hour before i'm due for ET. so i may have some time with DH alone to talk it over. i know that it's mostly the embryos deciding for the patient based on their status but i wanted to have some direction for two reasons: (1) i was told that i'll likely have enough to push to blast but that the best ones would be just enough to put back on day 3 and (2) another clinic i consulted with was only going to wait for a day 5 transfer even if the embryos were arresting on day 3. it's a bit risky because i don't have a large number of follicles now (i'm scheduled for ER in 2 days) but i think i'll have enough that i could push to blast if i felt comfortable with that route. thanks for helping!

    Jen there is no way on earth you or anyone else can possibly know now how your egg or embryos will do.

  11. hi Spartali, i definitely didn't ask how my embryos would do just for insights into ET decisions as there are decisions to make.

    and, no, my doctor said i was just a bit stressed setting up my out-of-state first cycle and it turned out that once i began cycling i felt great! like you said, it isn't for routine stress setting up 2 wks across the country. plus, i wanted to rent an apt. instead of a hotel which was hard to do.

    i definitely say a prayer for the health of a person that makes up bizarre distortions to attack a stranger on a questions message board for asking questions. my heart goes out for someone in that state of mind.

  12. hi. what is this? i am in my first cycle now! and all has gone very well. thanks for asking! gosh, Green MI: you sound unwell. i have ER in 2 days as i just posted before i opened this thread. we were considering cycling in several states where my DH's company has office and he could relocate and work for the 2 wks. we would be out-of-state cycling.to Green MI: i hope you get the help you need so you can lead a good life.

    Suuuuuuuuuuuuure you're cycling. Why are you still asking questions about various clinics then? Oh and stop pretending you are cycling at Cornell.

    I'm very well thank you. I'm not going around asking if I should be on Paxil. (kisses)

  13. GOD YOU ARE SUCH A LIAR!

    Do you even remember all the lies you post? Just 11 days ago you didn't know what clinic you would be cycling at and contemplated cycling out of town.

    Quote - I don't know if I'll be cycling out of town - Written 11 days ago!

    JenLoveBallet = NOT an IVF patient

    http://www.ivfquestion.com/

  14. hi, thank you! my RE said this morning that it will probably be a hard decision given the mature follicle count today on stim day 10. and the embryologist at our clinic only looks on fert day and day 3. thanks for helping!

    If you are on cycle day 10 how come just 11 days ago you didn't know what clinic you would cycle at. Here is your post

    http://www.ivfquestion.com/

  15. Jen, how many follicles do you have 2 days before ER and what are their sizes? When are you taking your trigger shot? What doctors have you been seeing at Cornell?

  16. You could also freeze the remainder on day 3 but if you take them to blast you will have a better chance with your FETs later on because blasts have a higher implantation rate..

    Just to clarify since this sounded weird to me... if she had 3 left and froze them at day 3, or they tried to take those same three that are left to blast and 3 (or 1-2 of them) were frozen at the blast stage...the odds of success in that case do not increase because the original 3 were taken to blast over keeping them at day 3.

    Blasts have a higher implantation rate in a given cycle because you have already 'screened out' ones that likely would not have survived/implanted and kept the best looking ones, the ones that seem to be the most hardy/viable. Taking them to blast results in being able to make (generally assumed) better choices as to which ones to transfer in a cylce, and being able to choose to transfer less in a given cycle because they are already 'pre-selected' to be the ones most likely to work given that they survived to the blast stage.

    But if you are talking about the same 3 embryos, the odds of overall success is basically the same with those 3 embryos regardless of if they are frozen on day 3, or day 5.

  17. hi, thank you! my RE said this morning that it will probably be a hard decision given the mature follicle count today on stim day 10. and the embryologist at our clinic only looks on fert day and day 3. thanks for helping!

    I just saw another post where on 12-22 you said you were starting a cycle in three weeks which would be today. Which is it Jen?

    Then on 1-1-10 you make a post asking about cycling OOT. Today you claim to be on cycle day 10 with retrieval in 2 days. So when you made this post stating you might be cycling OOT you were in fact one day away from starting your cycle?

    Get a grip!

    01-01-2010, 04:18 PM #1
    estel
    Member (100+)

    Join Date: Nov 2008
    Posts: 192
    the benefit of monitoring at the out-of-town clinic?
    hi, i will probably be an out-of-town ("OOT") patient flying for my cycle.

    the clinics i have considered have recommended that i arrive OOT anywhere from stim CD5 to stim CD10 for OOT monitoring.

    i prefer to err on the safe side but i've been told by a couple of these clinics that they don't feel i need to be there prior to CD10 (which seems late to me but that's why i'm asking).

    of course, less time in a hotel and away from work and my dog, the better but i also don't want to risk my cycle over the monitoring.

    any input would be hugely appreciated! of course, i plan to pay to change the dates but what should i put for my initial planned travel dates?.
    thanks!!

  18. and, no, my doctor said i was just a bit stressed setting up my out-of-state first cycle and it turned out that once i began cycling i felt great! like you said, it isn't for routine stress setting up 2 wks across the country. plus, i wanted to rent an apt. instead of a hotel which was hard to do.

    10 days ago you said you would probably fly in as an OOT patient....wow you found an apartment very fast.

  19. Spartali see what I'm trying to say? estel is either lying about cycling or she is trolling as a pretend IVF patient.

  20. Yes I do see what you are saying.

  21. i have ER in 2 days

    So then your ER is tomorrow (Friday) Jen? When did you take your trigger shot? What type of trigger did you use?

    How is it that you said earlier that you were told you would likely have enough embryos to push for blast but you also said you did not have many follicles? And if you are indeed cycling at Cornell you also said that they want to do a day 3 transfer and NOT push for blast, and that they don't push to blast unless you have 10 embryos on day 3 which if you don't have many follicles as you said is not possible? And you said that "your nurse" recommended PGD if you have a few embryos on day 3 - a nurse at Cornell said that for your first IVF cycle?

  22. Spartali, why don't you take your own advice and just ignore JLB if her posts annoy you. Really, who gives a crxp if she's lying or not. IGNORE HER, like most others do, and eventually she'll get the hint and go away.

  23. hi, i'm back home now so i can be online more often.

    to clarify for the other members: even a couple weeks before i cycled, i was very close to cycling locally. i didn't decide until i started the stims. both clinics had consutled with me, drawn up my Rx orders and i decided the day before i started stims. i ordered my meds in two batches. the first was the day before i started. i started my stims on day 3.

    i looked for and found an apt in the last week before we left (while i was stimming). meds, airfare and apt. were all within the last 10 days before we left. and it worked well. the apt was nicer than we expected and we used the full kitchen and washing machine/dryer every single day. we only ate out for dinner one night in the 12 nights we were there. i highly recommend trying to find an apt.- we used VRBO.com).

    we did a day 3 transfer and i'm in the 2ww.

    this was my first cycle. i am glad i finally experienced a cycle and that i can now post on the board and speak from experience. however, i don't feel like i learned a ton of new information about ivf or cycling from my first cycle.

    i did learn that my response was much better than i expected during stimming. i definitely did learn first-hand the importance of daily monitoring towards the end of stimming. my follicles grew very quickly b/n day 8 and day 10.

    thank you to the healthy people who aren't abusive to others on our board.

  24. GOD YOU ARE SUCH A LIAR!Do you even remember all the lies you post? Just 11 days ago you didn't know what clinic you would be cycling at and contemplated cycling out of town.Quote - I don't know if I'll be cycling out of town - Written 11 days ago!JenLoveBallet = NOT an IVF patienthttp://www.ivfconnections.net/board...593#post2421593

    to "Green MI": you really are unwell and toxic.

    (actually pretty much every single one of "Green MI's" posts are nasty harassment of people all over our site. it's really pathetic and makes me sad for her and any child that may have to live under her some day. i'm not saying that to stoop to her level. but because she was abusive to me and it honestly worries me that a person like that could mistreat a child also, easily. it certainly won't be good for a child to have someone toxic like her as a mom.

    here is the link to her posts: every one of her posts is harassment of others except one post about tooth floss, honestly.

    and "Green MI" throws around the same exact pesonal attack to others as she did to me. i feel sorry for our board to have this type of disturbed member harassing people in the ivf community.
    http://www.ivfquestion.com/.

    for other members, i quoted that unwell person b/c it's relevant to my question:
    i don't see how one can purchase travel in advance when in a short stim protocol?

    i was unable to purchase my airline tickets or reserve our apt. out-of-town more than a week in advance because i wanted to be sure that i was not going to be cancelled. how do others make travel plans in advance?
    for my next cycle, i won't know when AF may arrive next so how would i reserve further in advance next time? i either won't use BCPs or only for a really short period.

    i may try a different (longer) protocol but if i use antagonist protocol again, i will only have about a week's notice to be out-of-state.

    and to everyone sane and functioning normally on our board, i am so sorry that you and i had to be exposed to an unwell member or two. i have received so much support from wonderful people on this site and i hope others stay. : )

  25. hi, i'm back home now so i can be online more often.to clarify for the other members: even a couple weeks before i cycled, i was very close to cycling locally. i didn't decide until i started the stims. both clinics had consutled with me, drawn up my Rx orders and i decided the day before i started stims. i ordered my meds in two batches. the first was the day before i started. i started my stims on day 3. i looked for and found an apt in the last week before we left (while i was stimming). meds, airfare and apt. were all within the last 10 days before we left. and it worked well. the apt was nicer than we expected and we used the full kitchen and washing machine/dryer every single day. we only ate out for dinner one night in the 12 nights we were there. i highly recommend trying to find an apt.- we used VRBO.com).we did a day 3 transfer and i'm in the 2ww. this was my first cycle. i am glad i finally experienced a cycle and that i can now post on the board and speak from experience. however, i don't feel like i learned a ton of new information about ivf or cycling from my first cycle. i did learn that my response was much better than i expected during stimming. i definitely did learn first-hand the importance of daily monitoring towards the end of stimming. my follicles grew very quickly b/n day 8 and day 10.thank you to the healthy people who aren't abusive to others on our board.

    LOL you are a riot. Good luck in your fantasy world.

    Psssst.....

    nobody believes you.

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